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January 27, 2007

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brooklyngoil

I went to DC yesterday with a group of friends from Brooklyn, N.Y. The weather in DC was perfect. The temperature stayed consistent around 50. The rally was really energetic and spirited. I haven’t been to any demonstrations in the past few years. It was pretty awesome to see some many faces – some I knew, most I didn’t. There were great contingents from hospital workers union SEIU, a variety of student groups including many SDS chapters, Iraq and Vietnam War vets for peace, anti-imperialists, leftist and left groups and non-affiliated folks.

I have to give serious props to World Can’t Wait for have such a cohesive, clear message at the demonstration. Bold placards, sharp street theater and clear politics calling for impeachment and bringing down the Bush regime were certainly on the mind of many of the speakers and the demonstrators of the day. Most of the signs called for ending the war now and bringing the troops home while one more liberally organized segment of the demo was calling for no troop escalation.

I was psyched to see so many organized student groups at the demo. They had a consistent oomph and had strong chant leaders with bullhorns. The chants linking the occupation in Palestine to Iraq were notable as I didn’t hear as much about Palestine as I expected.

While the early rally at the demo was energizing and motivating the march, organized by UFPJ was disorganized and meandering. There were no marshals nor chant leaders to be found and the brief march felt like we were going in circles – cause we were. We more or less did a short loop around the Mall. After the March the day just seemed to end. Were there any more speakers? Any next actions being projected by UFPJ? I may have missed it but after standing around and talking to a few folks from different cities my group began the trek home.

The last thing I will say I was deeply impressed with the passion and numbers of the Iraq war veterans. I have been at many demos in my life. Many anti-war demos for over 12-15 years. But I have never felt so at home at a demo than when I say all the young women and men from small towns across the South East and West. Vet’s from NC, Kentucky, Texas and LA were a striking reminder of

From the stage one Vet said, “Air Force Staff Sgt. Tassi McKee, 26, an intelligence specialist at Fort Meade, Md., said she joined the Air Force because of patriotism, travel and money for college.”After we went to Iraq, I began to see through the lies," she said.” From the LA Times. She stood next to agit-prop coffin sitting on the stage bearing a flag.

I say I felt at home because when I was in my teens and early twenties I watched many of my closest friends join the Army, the Corp from Flatlands, Bay Ridge, Canarsie and Bed Stuy because they wanted to chance at a better life. We’re a long way away from the cliché of soon to be yuppie college kids calling returning Vietnam vet’s baby killers and imperialists. And I think being apart of the demo, going to DC, getting involved in politics is not only easier but makes more sense because of the changes in the class composition of the movement today.

the burningman

Totally.

The soldiers and marines returning from the war are speaking with a clarity and determination. I managed to speak to a few folks in DC, and was lucky enough to catch the co-founder of Appeal for Redress, Liam Madden, at a NYC World Can't Wait meeting last Thursday. The decency, thoughtfulness and determination of these folks is what's going to end this war.

Provide these soldiers and marines, as well as their families, a platform anywhere and everywhere you can. Please note the speaking tour in the post above!

People say "keep it real"... well, let's make it real.

got to say it

Brooklyngoil is dead on about the UFPJ disorganized meandering. The problem wasn't just logistical. It was political.

You get the feeling that if Bush nukes Iran, the best they would sanction was another round of registering tepid dissent.

the burningman

Okay, everybody knows the problems with UFPJ. Venting about it doesn't change our responsibility to do what we do. UFPJ doesn't hold a monopoly on jack shizzle. They aren't to blame for the "state of the movement" because they don't own this movement.

Instead of griping about who isn't doing what, let's at least try to ground the discussion in what we are doing and where we need to be moving.

That's what I really dig in the think piece by Andy and Dan Berger. They are impatient, too – but do not define their critique in the inadequacies of others...

brooklyngoil

BM,

Overall great report!

I did have an opportunity to listen to the majority of the speeches on saturday and I would say a solid core of them spoke to the lack of hope many of us feel towards to Dems. Also a trifecta of final speeches made from the stage by Susan Sarandon, Sean Penn and Tim Robbins called for Bush's impeachment. They called for something beyond just "no escalation." It was a heady message to jump off the march with.

*********

Aside from this while I have political disagreements with both JJ and WWP, I thought both

brooklyngoil

oops. I'll save my comments on WWP and JJ for a later time. gotta get back to work at the dildo hut.

Thano Paris

Burningman, Thanks for the great report! My favorite part of the demo was when we marched passed a small crew of like 20 counter demonstrators and started chanting at them " Enlist! Enlist! Enlist!"--One muslim sister said it best "Don't talk about it--Be about it!". If you're so down with the carnage and slaughter happening there send your damn self!

Stanley W. Rogouski

I spent the whole day leafleting the throngs. In the thick of it, I never got a sense of the crowd's relative size. It was big. Protest sponsor United for Peace & Justice claims 200,000, DC police 150,000.

I don't think it was anywhere near 200,000 people. When I went to the Save Darfur rally earlier last year, it took up one square on the mall (ie one block) and the media (which is favorable to the Save Darfur movement in a way it's not to the anti-war movement) said 40,000. So I'd give this rally about 50,000 people on the mall and another 5,000 or so milling about.

What actually impressed me was the way some fairly mainstream people seem to be moving to the left. Leslie Cagan and UFPJ actually let a Palestinian group condemn the occupation on stage. Michael Lerner spoke with a Muslim cleric on stage. Jerry Nadler (fresh from his disgracefull appearence at the bomb Lebanon rally last Summer) showed up, made speeches, palled around with Jesse Jackson and even helped negotiate with the Capitol Police to stop blocking the march in back of the Capitol Building.

Even Ana Marie Cox got it right. Bizarrely enough I was probably standing a few feet away from her while she was watching the *actual waterboarding* on Constitution Avenue (I was one of those people snapping photos and doing nothing while she went to the cops and tried to have it stopped).

http://time-blog.com/swampland/2007/01/at_the_rally.html

http://www.pbase.com/srogouski/waterboarding

But I think some of the Indymedia jerks actually have it right.

There has to be something beyond mass demonstrations like this led by left wing Democrats.

World Can't Wait's strategy is a start but I think that they ulimately wind up tailing UFPJ and the anti-war movement.

The WCW strategy is to go to mass events like this as well as to stage their own events *that basically conform to and mirror the style of UFPJ's events* with permits, controlled barricaded marches, and attempts at building coalitions.

I know the argument is that WCW will bring more radical demands to the table but it seems to end up meaning that you bring slightly different signs and wear more orange jumpsuits.

Yes, the fact that Leslie Cagan and crowd are adjusting and including more radical demands into their program is a good sign but I also think it's going to stall out and "we" made need to start doing civil disobedience or using smaller, quicker more frequent kinds of demonstrations or something nobody here has thought of yet.

But pressuring the Democrats isn't going to work and tailing UFPJ isn't going to work.

brooklyngoil

in terms of numbers the washington post quoted the DC police as saying there were 150K people at the demo. UFPJ says 200K. I'd split the def.

Stanley W. Rogouski

in terms of numbers the washington post quoted the DC police as saying there were 150K people at the demo. UFPJ says 200K. I'd split the def.

Not even close but there's no need to correct them if they want to overestimate it.

And this thing certainly got a ton of media coverage.

Stanley W. Rogouski

I mean no need to correct the media. With UFPJ it's a problem. They actually claimed there 500,000 people. I may have misheard Leslie Cagan at the end but it sounded as if she said that.

Really large marches on the DC mall (like the Millions More March or some of the pro choice marches) have a tendency to make you feel uncomfortable, unable to move.

I didn't get that feeling at this one.

But it was definitely over 50,000.

Chanders

So WCW is now pushing impeachment as "driving out the Bush regime?" Rhetorically impressive, as it means you can keep your placards and tag lines without printing new ones, but it seems a little weak. I always thought of "driving out the Bush regime" as more of a mass popular uprising. Is John Conyers replacing Chairman Bob as the current RCP eminence grise?

That said, and snarkiness aside, nice report Jed. Nothing more frustrating than being stuck back in NYC with a technologically dead local Indymedia and a shitty DC Indymedia.

Stanley W. Rogouski

So WCW is now pushing impeachment as "driving out the Bush regime?" Rhetorically impressive, as it means you can keep your placards and tag lines without printing new ones, but it seems a little weak. I always thought of "driving out the Bush regime" as more of a mass popular uprising. Is John Conyers replacing Chairman Bob as the current RCP eminence grise?

I dunno. Maybe we should just take people at their word when they say that WCW and the RCP are seperate groups and that WCW isn't a "front group".

Conyer's a good guy who will sign onto a lot (although he'll often back off from criticizing the Israelis) but he's not an intellectual with a consistent body of work that's in the process of developing a strategy of how to confront the state and the ruling class.

That would certainly describe Bob Avakian (who I like). But Avakian isn't directly engaged right now with any kind of movement (and by engaged I mean on a day to day level).

But in spite of that people in WCW really do have a maturity and a dedication I don't see in many activists.

Stanley W. Rogouski

I think one thing I'd like to see is some kind of rapid response/pr campaign to combat the kinds of lies about any kind of Communist organizers that gets shoveled into the ears of mainstream progressive people and doesn't really get called for bullshit often enough.

That is going to happen with WCW again and again. Questioning St. Bill Clinton's motives in Yugoslavia means you're a supporter of Milosovic. Questioning MacCarthur's plan to roll back the Chinese revolution means you're a fan of North Korea.

And this crap gets believed without question by otherwise skeptical and intelligent people. I mean, it's amazing how you can get a copy of Revolution and show people the article about Yugoslavia which clearly demonstrates the RCP never supported Milosovic, read people the relevent passages and they'll still come away saying "uh but don't communists support Milosovic".

50 years of anti-communist propaganda has made a lot of people just plain stupid.

Chanders

Stanley,

OK, the bit about Conyers and Avakian was an uncalled for snark. And I'm really not concerned with debating about whether WCW is or is not a front group of the RCP, either.

All I was really trying to say is that calling for the impeachment of Bush has the problem of simultaneously being not really all that radical a strategy and not at all likely to succeed. If you're going to embrace left / liberal talking points, like impeachment, you might as well call for things like cutting off the funding of troops, which is a left-Democrat position that perhaps actually has the chance of someday suceeding. If you're going to embrace a more radical position, "impeaching Bush" seems pretty lame, at best.

I'm not necessarily knocking either of these strategies-- what I am saying is that disguising impeachment in radical language ("drive out the Bish regime!") seems dishonest and a bit histrionic.

Stanley W. Rogouski

If you're going to embrace a more radical position, "impeaching Bush" seems pretty lame, at best.

You know, I actually like the idea of impeaching Bush, even if in the long run we still have to drive him out through a popular uprising.

Why?

It will get a lot of this shit *on paper* for the world to see. A good impeachment hearing will reach deep down into the roots of the Bush regime and show how it extends all the way back to the Iran Contra criminals Bush I pardonned.

In the end, I don't think it will be enough but often an attempt at formal democratic legitimacy will empower revolutionaries.

That's actually what I saw yestersay in DC. Even communists who don't think elections mean very much were empowered by the idea that the people voted for an end to the war. Even Sunsara on O'Reilly used the elections to good effect by essentially saying "don't bullshit me. You know the majority of the people are against this and they voted for it".

Stanley W. Rogouski

you might as well call for things like cutting off the funding of troops, which is a left-Democrat position that perhaps actually has the chance of someday suceeding.

You know, I don't think it does. There's a very strange climate in DC right now and those left Democrats are in a very strange position.

I don't really mean Kucinich and Conyers and the few genuine leftists in Congress. I mean people like John Edwards. You've got him in the United States talking about "two Americas" and the need for more unions and more workers right.

Then what happens? He goes to Israel, talks up Arial Sharon and attacks his fellow Americans for not being more in favor of invading Iran.

Is Edwards typical of the Democratic Party? Are Webb, Hillary, Obama, Schumer, Feingold, Nancy Pelosi any different.

If this were Central America I'd say "yeah I bet Pelosi and the Dems are going to give Bush some trouble but for God's sake this is the Middle East and I'd never count on the Dems going against AIPAC.

If one did, that would be a genuinely courageous moment. And I doubt we're going to see it.

steev

I don't understand the hope of so many to impeach Bush. Then we'd just have Cheney. And besides, why bother? the process will take at least 2 years and he'll be out anyway in 2 years. it just doesn't make sense to put so much energy into the impeachment process.

the other within

Did somebody say histrionic?

ShineThePath

I have no problem with Impeaching Bush, but lets be clear on what it is and what it is not. For WCW, the idea sums up to a "radical new direction" for society..."Driving out the Bush Regime" and its "Agenda" is not going to happen with Impeachment. We are not going to have a new revolutionary consciousness within the State and we will be within the confines of the state, atleast the status quo antebush.

So what is being asked for and pushed for is reform, and reform within the Bourgeois system. Perhaps a reform that can produce revolutionary consciousness and a new political voice, but nonetheless reform itself. So lets definately Impeach Bush, but be honest about what this reform means...so in a sense, needing a little be of sober vision.

Stanley W. Rogouski

I don't understand the hope of so many to impeach Bush. Then we'd just have Cheney.

There have been enough books written about impeaching Bush (by Dave Lindorff and John Nichols among others) there's really no excuse to believe this.

First of all, if Bush is guilty of impeachable crimes who the hell cares if Cheney is next in line to be president. This is a bit like saying that you shouldn't prosecute John Gotti because the Russians who come after him will only be worse.

But more importantly, there's no way Cheney would survive an impeachment hearing for Bush. Cheney is so wrapped up in Bush's crimes, so complicit in everything that's gone on for the past 6 years that any impeachment process will turn up dirt on Cheney like bodies under John Wayne Gacy's house when you start digging.

Impeach Bush and you'll get Nancy Pelosi not Cheney. Admittedly this is hardly the ideal outcome but more likely than not an impeachment process will open up radical possibilities both in the electoral arena and for popular rebellion that wouldn't exist without it.

Itchy B. Scratchy

Tnx for passing on that article by Dan Berger and Andy Cornell.

If any information about a NV direct action network comes around, please post it.

Alex

"I didn't hear many of the speeches – and the one I caught by Jesse Jackson sounded like a remix. "Keep hope ALIVE Keep HOPE alive..." and I'm thinking, "WTF you talking about?"

I have to admit I was impressed by Salt Lake City's Mayor Rocky Anderson's speech. I actually stopped and listened to it.

He even stuck a copy of it right on his official website.

http://www.slcgov.com/mayor/speeches/2007%20Speeches/012707washingtondcantiwarspeech-web.pdf

Christopher Day

Where are the regulars who can raise the level of debate here?

I disagree with a great deal of what Stanley is saying here, but I think there is something to the following:

"I know the argument is that WCW will bring more radical demands to the table but it seems to end up meaning that you bring slightly different signs and wear more orange jumpsuits."

I appreciate what WCW is doing trying to spearhead an upsurge around impeachment. But I think the question of how different the EFFECTS of its demands end out being from UFPJ's involves a move from protest to resistance.
WCW should be applauded for its rhetorical promotion of resistance, but there is a crying need for more ACTUAL resistance. I understand that the present moment is not auspicious for "wild in the streets" militance just yet. But I think there are a lot of people who would respond to a call for mass non-violent civil disobedience targetting members of congress and demanding that they 1. Defund the War and 2. Impeach Bush and Cheney.

There is a whole constituency of religious pacifists and indpenedent radicals who are deeply frustrated with both UFPJ and ANSWER, but who also want more than sharp looking placards and guerrilla theater. WCW could make big strides among these folks that it isn't yet making. I don't think this sort of thing is likely to alienate the angry liberals WCW has been cultivating either. On the contrary I think it would give some of them a congenial way to deepen their radicalization.

There is no reason that WCW couldn't both play a leading role in a broad anti-impeachment movement AND take the tactics up a notch.

I believe a call for a day of "protest and resistance" at congressional offices with a dozen CD actions targetting the most centrist Democrats would simultaneously help break the anti-war movement out of its rut AND provide support for more progressive Dems who committed to impeachment and defunding.

brooklyngoil

ditto chris! I think turning up the heat on the cntr could have the dual effect of galvanizing the anti-war movemnt and creating more space for all progressive forces.

I would love to see us use some creative tactics. Anyone wanna hold a protest vigil outside of Chuck Shumer's home in the Slope?

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